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Old 11-04-2008, 07:35 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Spanish jobless hits 12-year high

The number of unemployed people in Spain has reached a 12-year high of 11.3%, according to the Labour Ministry, the highest level in Europe.

As recession looms in Spain, European Union statistics put the jobless figure even higher at 11.9%.

The number claiming unemployment benefit rose by 192,658 to 2,818,026 - the highest level since April 1996.

A severe slowdown in the construction industry has been one of the the main causes of the economic slowdown.

Recent figures showed that the economy contracted by 0.2% in the third quarter compared to the previous three-month period.

Since October 2007, the number of those claiming jobless benefits has risen 37.5%.

On Monday the government set out a plan to help unemployed people who had difficulty keeping up with mortgage payments.



Story from BBC NEWS:
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Old 11-04-2008, 08:24 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Thnks ColinS
I looked on the BBC Website and could bot find this anywhere.
However, it does look as though the Spanish economy is in for a real tough time. During the 1990's recession they devalued the peseta several times within the EMS but they don't have that option this time round and have to do it the "hard way" - and that will take years!

Another curious issue that I find interesting is is the presence of a local "mini-economy". The Costa Blanca North area has a huge number of properties owned by non-spanish and most are not resident. This creates a huge service industry dedicated to maintaining these properties and a smaller service industry providing services to them.
This is unlikely to be affected because the non-resident property owners would want to maintain their second-homes and would probably be able to afford to do so.

All we need right now is for real estate values to bottom out and I think that will happen quite soon.
With the banking world in turmoil (they have stated that even banks don't trust each other any more) where do those turn with "a few bob" to invest?
Gold, oil futures, the stock market - too risky! Government or Local Authority Bonds - they pay little interest! Somewhere like Icebank!
The only real option is property! Sooner rather than later investors will realise that there are real opportunities now in Spanish property.

You are in the business ColinS, with your finger on the feebily twitching pulse, what do you think? Is Spanish real estate going into cardiac arrest or is that pulse going to start beating healthily again?
Hopefully it won't start pounding fit to burst and create another bubble!

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Last edited by Homefinder; 11-04-2008 at 08:28 PM.
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Old 11-05-2008, 12:32 AM   #3 (permalink)
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In the Uk (and I know Spain isn't the Uk) "they" predicted a 8% fall in values this year and 7% next year with things picking up in 2010.

So far, according to the nationwide, prices have dropped by 15% this year and they are now predicting a 25% drop overall with values returning to 2007 levels by 2013.

Now considering the £ has dropped to 1.22 against the euro, property prices in Spain are going up relatively speaking for UK buyers.

I hate to disagree Homefinder but if all the above feeds through, Spanish prices have a long way to fall yet.

Trying to sound positive is worth a shot though , you never know!
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Old 11-05-2008, 04:25 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Thank you Sharon, very interesting comments.
By nature I tend to be a pessimist and I was one of the first to start predicting "doom and gloom" for the Spanish ecomony. In fact I wrote an article about it in 2004: Spanish Ecomomic Recession Here is an extract from that -
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I believe that the Spanish Economy, especially Tourism and Construction are heading for a serious recession. Hopefully it will not be as severe as in the ’90, when property values in coastal areas fell by more than half. A recent article suggests that prices will fall by up to 20 - 30% hopefully it won’t be worse than this.
Unfortunately I was only looking at the Spanish economy, otherwise I would have seen how banks everywhere where rushing headlong into a sub-prime crisis and starting a world recession.

So now, way ahead of most opinions, I am saying that I can see a glimmer of light at the end of the tunnel.
Speaking very generally, certain events can always be predicted and follow simple cause and effect rules. With the ups and downs of economies the cause is difficult to determine but the effect is easy and quite simply a recession has to follow a boom and viceversa.
We all live in our own (relatively) tiny worlds but, as far as the Spanish real estate situation is concerned, two very clear facts are obvious. Those are that there is as much interest as ever but fewer are actually buying.

Why are they not buying? Buyers are not buying because they are expecting prices to fall. In any market, when buyers are expecting prices to fall that is exactly what happens.

Cause and Effect! If you agree that a recession cannot continue forever then eventually the market must recover. This will happen when the first few fore-sighted buyers decide that the recession is over and the time has come to commit.

An important point that you have missed but which probably only applies to certain areas and I only really know about the Costa Blanca North, principally from Altea to Denia. There is a min sub-economy here in the respect that most of the sellers are Brits who purchased when the £ was much stronger.
Most of these intend to repatriate the funds and most can well afford to make a considerable reduction and still have a handsome profit.

It is not quite as simple as that however. The buyers want to make as much profit as possible and they have seen their property value climb to dizzy heights. The whole thing is like a huge 3-dimensional game of poker, with sellers on one side, buyers on the other and the "pot" reducing. Eventually the sellers either have to pull out or "show their hand" and at this point the buyer wins. Other buyers see this happening and raise their bids and win. Then the buyers who retired come back into the game and the "pot" starts to increase.

Nobody can predict when it will all turn around but, as the months go by, more and more potential buyers come on the scene. Currently the number of properties for sale is still increasing as well. Eventually, because some sellers will simply remove their properties from sale, the seesaw will swing the other way.

I am now going to make my own prediction. The recovery will start to happen early next year and get under way so slowly that it will be hardly noticed at first. Prices will continue to fall at the beginning as the Spanish economic recession starts to bite and repossesed properties enter the market.
By 2011 the market will have recovered with values overall adjusted down and perhaps half or less of the "boom-time" volumn.

There will never, ever be another boom that will create a bubble - no government could be that stupid the next time around. Off-plan, short term profit taking will be a thing of the past and banks will be very careful in future about lending - thay won't have the funds to do it with anyway!
I cannot even begin to think what will happen to the huge surplus of new, unsold property. During the next few years the population of Spain will decrease as unemployment increases and immigrants go back home, leaving empty properties behind, and that is the real problem that Spain has to face - quite simply they have to do it all again from scratch!

Homefinder

Last edited by Homefinder; 11-05-2008 at 04:30 PM.
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Old 11-06-2008, 04:37 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Hello Homefinder,

Sellers obviously want to sell their house and get a good price.
Agents want to make a honest living selling property and this is easier if there are lots of buyers.
I'm in the third category, buyers, and we always like to feel we are getting a good deal without too much risk.

It wasn't too hard to be a buyer, seller or agent (I assume) when prices were increasing. If you bought a property, it's value would likely go up so it would be difficult to lose and you could always sell it if things don't work out. But now they are falling, it's hard for everyone, because like you say, the decision is if you find the right property, when do you jump in and will you be able to sell if things go wrong. (hence caution)

I agree with what you are saying but I don't think that sellers are reducing their prices enough yet to start people buying which like you say will stimulate the whole process. Certainly they aren't in the rural areas where I'm looking. Most people seem to be holding tight and waiting for everyone else to sell so things improve. I think that's why prices are falling quickly, because the only sales are from properties that have been reduced significantly or are highly desirable.
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Old 11-06-2008, 05:06 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Hi Sharon - Thank you for that, you have explained it in a simple straightforward way. You did well to understand it - because sometimes I even confuse myself!

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Old 11-06-2008, 05:16 PM   #7 (permalink)
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did I

must be because I am simple
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